jo's Reviews > Ghost World

Ghost World by Daniel Clowes
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really liked it
bookshelves: graphic, kids

american representations of adolescents and post-adolescents in films and books have always left me cold, if not alienated. why do i have so little in common with these kids? why was my life and the lives of the italian teens i currently know and follow so vastly different? i blame american culture of violence and vice (for lack of a better world), kids' need to find themselves in drunkenness and drugs, when we had... what? what did we have? what do the italian kids i know have?

i think we had, they have each other, large groups of kids roaming the city in various combos, girls, boys, girls and girls, boys and boys. i think we had mobility and cities designed for people not cars. we had walking distance and we had public transportation. also, we had spaces, public spaces, outdoor spaces designed for hanging out -- in neighborhoods (mainly in front of the church), in the city. lots of spaces. plazas, fountains, pedestrian-only streets, small public gardens (italy is lousy with public gardens, unlike its neighbors to the north), benches, stones, steps to buildings and monuments, sidewalks. there are people everywhere, the city is inhabited.

when i see kids represented in american films and books, i see a ton of emptiness. kids hang out in commercial not public spaces, because the concept of a well-tended, well-protected, accessible, attractive public space is pretty much non-existent. in my university, even the box office of the newly renewed football/baseball/whatever stadium is named after a donor. i honestly and sincerely anticipate that soon we'll have to preface a lecture with "this class is brought to you by...".

if you have nowhere to go, and if you can't go there anyway because you have no transportation except your parents, you hang out in malls, diners, ice cream parlors, fast food joints, bowling alleys, or the back of your school. the latter is maybe the best scenario. i cannot imagine a childhood so starkly defined by commerce. i know that kids everywhere breathe commerce, but i cannot imagine a childhood so controlled by commerce that there are literally no spaces that are free of it.

so this book got me down during its first half. i hate empty american cities, big and small, and kids lost in it. i hated the terrible disaffection, rage, and plain nastiness of enid and rebecca. i hate the heavily underscored lack of family life, this eternal american parentlessness -- the trope of the absent parent, independent as it is from the fact of the parent's physical existence.

but then i started feeling tenderness for the two girls, because of their tender love for each other, their tip-toeing around the conventions that allow its various modes of expression, the light narrative touches that convey how straying from the rigid boundaries of these conventions becomes just too much (a closing panel that simply says, "let go of my hand"). i also started feeling tenderness for the way in which the girls talk to each other through boys -- by talking about boys, by passing boys from one to the other, by obsessing over boys, by despising ugly boys. it's such a lonely and doomed love, so unfree to blossom, so constrained, it breaks your heart.

and at the end, of course, it withers and dies, not like a raisin in the sun, but like a dream that was squashed from the start. bleak, man.

i blame this on suffocating locales, sordid city aesthetics, mangled architecture, and a ton of institutionalized loneliness.

i wish our cities, our american cities, the very best, but i don't see how anything short of demolition and stark rebuilding will make them more friendly to kids, less conducive to such a powerful absorption of ugliness that life will be forever marked by it. after finishing the book i slept and i dreamed, as i heartbreakingly often do, of century-layered, beautiful cities, rambling living rooms for roamers, chatters, and lovers alike.
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Reading Progress

November 28, 2009 – Shelved
February 7, 2010 – Started Reading
February 7, 2010 – Shelved as: graphic
February 7, 2010 – Shelved as: kids
February 7, 2010 – Finished Reading

Comments Showing 1-22 of 22 (22 new)

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message 1: by [deleted user] (new)

ah ah ah...poor America! There's a sequence somewhere in Gaiman's Sandman comics - as usual, I can't remember which one exactly - where a man finds himself in the dream of cities - the landscapes cities dream themselves - unpeopled, rain-wet, dark. Whoever it was who got lost in this dream eventually finds his way out, but wonders, horribly, that if the cities are dreaming, then what will happen when the cities wake up. I don't know what this has to do with your review. I guess your review just made me think about my city, which this morning is getting swallowed by snow and steam, and how as a kid I'd have to go out and fight all that snow to get anywhere, so all the public spaces have this underground feel to them. Although, in the summer, we'd come above ground again, but it's a different city in the summer.

Blah blah. Lovely review...let go of my hand...that's going to stick with me.


message 2: by jo (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo i am thinking now of how much american literature deals with the big empty city -- or the big crowded city, or the small run-down town, or the suburbs. still, emptiness everywhere, of one kind or another. and how much immigrant literature (jhumpa lahiri!) deals with the empty nightmare of american living quarters. me, i'm obsessed with this theme. ob-fucking-sessed. i still can't get over the fact that, in most here cities, you just can't go take a walk. i mean, you can, technically, but you wouldn't quite want to, cuz there nothing to see.

hey, i actually think you live in one of the good ones, don't you?




message 3: by Eh?Eh! (new)

Eh?Eh! Great review. I feel your loss for open, unlabeled spaces.

i don't see how anything short of demolition and stark rebuilding will make them more friendly to kids, less conducive to such a powerful absorption of ugliness

I hate to see acres and acres of unbroken suburban housing, where you have to go a long distance to reach a store, church, school, park, library, museum, arterial road (to escape!), or monument. And then the closest hangout away from home is a strip mall. Ugh. I think one of the causes for this is zoning, where you can't really mix different types of uses in useful proximity. This seems to be less a problem near a city, where population concentration will support little outposts businesses and provide a tax base to fund public spaces (like parks), but maybe not enough thought was put into some suburbs.


message 4: by [deleted user] (new)

hey, i actually think you live in one of the good ones, don't you?

I don't know - it's so hard to say. It's not very city-like in some ways, because it's too spread out - this metastasizing lawn monster that keeps gobbling up all the farmland. I live in one of the more city-ish parts, and I love that I can walk places and the boy can walk to school, and that there are parks, businesses and neighbors all mixed together, but all kinds of my friends and family just couldn't wait to move an hour out of the city so they could spend approx 6000 hours a week commuting and living in their own personal manicured woodland - the emptiness and constant crawling travel must be attractive on some level, but I certainly don't get it. And the first indoor mall was built here. Sorry about that.



message 5: by [deleted user] (new)

Oh, hey Eh! Cross-post. My folks were urban activists back in the day, and it was all about zoning for them - you can really change how a city develops with one set of rules or another - like zoning requirements that force businesses to have X number of dedicated parking spaces - welcome to the suburbanization of any urban area.


message 6: by jo (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo Eh! wrote: "I think one of the causes for this is zoning, where you can't really mix different types of uses in useful proximity."

yes, that seems entirely right. i have always meant to read about this but never got around to it. a friend of mine explained to me once that everything in america changed with the building of the highway system. something else i'd love to read about.



message 7: by jo (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo Ceridwen wrote: "and the boy can walk to school"

children walking to school seems to me a major hallmark of civilization and livability. so much is gained, humanly, from street interaction -- figuring out who to walk with and who not to walk with, anticipating surprises of encounters, having a sort of breathing community out in the street and not only at home or in the car. someone just told me that her 6 year old nephew who lives in london goes to school by public bus by himself. now, that seems a bit too much to me (i walked to school by myself at six, but the bus? hmmm), yet, wow.

anyone here ever listen to Smart City? it's on our public radio station on sunday mornings at 6 am, so i don't catch is ALL THAT OFTEN (haha), but it's great! http://www.smartcityradio.com/


message 8: by Eh?Eh! (last edited Feb 08, 2010 12:00PM) (new)

Eh?Eh! Hah, how's it been, Ceridwen. Cross-posting.

I once had to design a parking lot, stuffing that X number of dedicated parking spaces into a small area - I hated it! They made me take out the planter strips to make room for more parking...well, also to accomodate the turning radius of a fire truck, I guess that's important.

And the interstate construction project, yes, huge impact on American society that we're still dealing with and benefiting/hurting from. Multi-purpose. It wasn't called the System of Interstate and Defense Highways for nothing. It served to provide work after the war and lay down a handy network for military deployment (my history teacher brought up the point that the long straightaways could be used as landing strips for military planes). It also brought on the American car culture, since people could then easily travel long distances. And shipping of goods became biiiiiig business, with powerful lobbies that direct federal attention and money away from other domestic needs...I think about this a little bit.

I understand the desire to have "wide, open spaces" about you, but crickey, it does seem better to contain ourselves a little bit since lots of people are unable to live responsibly (i.e., not waste stuff). With that containment comes the walking distances.


message 9: by jo (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo ah, you know whereof you are talking! very interesting about the long highways being doubleable as landing strips. fucking scary man. you have a good friendly book about it to mention in this here thready thingie, Eh?


message 10: by Eh?Eh! (new)

Eh?Eh! Oooh, I would love to be able to list off a bunch of recommended books here, perfect opportunity! But I can't. I'm sure there are plenty of tomes written on the subject...I learned briefly about the highways from social studies classes and a bit more in self-research when I started college, tiny bits about urban planning from the development group at my work, and the rest of it in passing as a civil engineer.

Um, so it's mostly unsubstantiated observations. I shrink as I type this.

The main lesson I've gathered through the years is that one community/infrastructure problem is usually indicative of other problems and insufficient planning in the past that didn't take enough factors into consideration. The whole urban planning and development process appeared to be a trial-and-error process, where we're in the stage of learning from errors but we can't really wipe them out because they've all been constructed and in use for many years now. Industries have built up and are dependent on these bad practices. And it takes so much money to do anything at all! It's incredibly, hair-tearingly frustrating and political.


message 11: by [deleted user] (new)

Um, so it's mostly unsubstantiated observations. I shrink as I type this.

No, don't shrink, I've totally heard that too, about the rationale for the Interstate Highway system being part of our strange, Cold War paranoia. I've heard the plane-landing thing too, and I don't disbelieve it, even though it sounds really hokey and hair-brained, because often planning is really hair-brained and hokey. Like, really? this is why we spent roughly a bazillion dollars on roads? So we can land some planes when the Reds attack?

It's incredibly, hair-tearingly frustrating and political.

No doubt. I live by one of our local urban planning disasters from the 70s - they torn down a cute business district comprised of brownstones & put up a suburban style Kmart with a big, yawning parking lot in front - just a perfect space to get wasted, sell illegal documentation/drugs/whatever and litter, because unlike other open, urban spaces, it's not good for anything at all. The surrounding neighborhoods have been trying to root out that KMart for years - and I should probably say I don't have anything against KMart per se, but I do have something against the planners who rammed that building into that space, touting it as an "anchoring point" for the neighborhood - Orwellian bastards. KMart's not going anywhere though, until we grease their palms with money we don't have, or eminent domain them out of there with political muscle we don't have.


message 12: by Eh?Eh! (new)

Eh?Eh! That's terrible! Who allowed that? Were some local politicians' hands greased to slide that store through? The anti-big box activists are moderately strong here, at least against Wal-mart. I've heard that it's been blocked in my college town and my current town. But other big boxes have sprung up like weeds.


Frank My favorite review of anything I have ever found on this site. Nuanced and profound. The alienation of Americans is part of the national psyche. It pulses through our veins like poison. We are so toxic that we kill everything we touch.


message 14: by jo (last edited Apr 01, 2014 06:14PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo that's high praise, frank. thank you so much. and don't be so down on this great country. some things were born here that infected the whole world -- the women's movement, civil rights, gay rights...


Frank Actually none of those movements really started here. Women suffrage happened until 1920 well behind a lot other countries. Slavery was abolished by the British in 1800. They're have been plenty of gay tolerant societies in human history. Just because we are moving in the right direction now doesn't mean we can't loose our way. America is really far behind in education, healthcare, legal equality, corruption, government, and woefully out of date bill of rights and constitution.


Trish Brilliant. Agree with Frank that this review is profound....years later...


message 17: by jo (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo Trish wrote: "Brilliant. Agree with Frank that this review is profound....years later..."

thank you trish!


Trish Jo, do you mind if I tweet or otherwise spread this review...always giving you credit of course? It really does sort of get to the heart of it all.


message 19: by jo (new) - rated it 4 stars

jo Trish wrote: "Jo, do you mind if I tweet or otherwise spread this review...always giving you credit of course? It really does sort of get to the heart of it all."

you kidding man? i'm so fucking honored. you can even tag me on twitter (which i never use) so i see if anyone has anything to add (i'll use it for the occasion!). it's @jonievulcano :)


Trish Excellent. Thanks for the tagline.


just passing by This was a beautiful review that made me think about a lot of things I had never been able to articulate. Thank you for that.


Dawson Escott Such a beautiful review. I feel like a lot of reviewers didn't pay enough attention to the environment of the novel.


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