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See, that’s what the app is perfect for.

Sounds perfect Wahhhh, I don’t wanna
klugpuuo
byjove

I think the Reddit idea of gender equality is seeping into this site tbh. “What about the women who do [TERRIBLE THING]?” and “Think about the men who are also victims of [TERRIBLE THING]!” are not appropriate responses to posts talking about women’s issues, especially issues that statistically effect women at a much higher rate than men. Throwing centrifuge into discussions about things like femicide and domestic violence against women is really not helpful.

Saying “Hey, men are statistically more likely to do/perpetuate this bad thing.” is not bioessentialism or particularly radical. It is a real problem backed up by statistics and it must be addressed to stop it from continuing. Men are not destined to do this bad thing. It is offensive to me as a man to pretend like men do not have a choice to not be shitty. We are not born to do that bad thing. We live in a society and culture that continuously makes excuses for men and teaches them from birth to perpetuate the patriarchy and see women as lesser and it tries to teach us we are not performing their gender correctly if they are not subjugating women. With the current fascist cultural slide in the USA, it’s more important than ever to criticize the men willfully perpetuating these ideas and openly hating women because the manosphere and the far right are a current and massive threat to women and to the success of mankind as a whole, tbh.

Yes, things like domestic violence against men, men’s mental health, homicidal violence with male victims and the effects of toxic masculinity on men are all very important things to discuss. Just not on posts specifically about women.

dragongirlsnout
doe-eyed-disaster

explaining gamergate to future generations: so video games were looked down on for being toys meant for little boys to play with and they didn't like that, so they spent a lot of time and effort crafting elaborate arguments on forums far and wide that video games were serious art and deserved serious analysis, but then they were very unhappy when a woman did exactly that, so in order to prove they weren't a bunch of racist misogynists, they went on a years long harassment campaign against a bunch of women which both ruined the fun of criticizing the star wars sequels *and* eventually helped the United States get rid of federal abortion rights, but at the end of the day it was worth it because all of our video game news is written by ai instead of women with dyed hair

june-egbert-official

it's important to me to mention that the bulk of this is absolutely wrong. it was never about "ethics in games journalism" or games as art. those were covers for what it really was; a bitter nazi who got dumped by his non-binary partner (who went on to get major acclaim for their game, depression quest). he tried to start a hate mob on the something awful forums to harass them.

except... he was laughed off the site. so he went to 4chan where "ironic" racism had already begun to give way to genuine racism (which it always really had been, but that's a different post).


this is what kick-started the movement, complete with the "it's about ethics in games journalism" cover story (it was claimed zoe quinn traded sexual favors for good reviews) and was used as a means of harassing other women* in gaming.

*yes zoe quinn is non-binary, but chuds didn't care enough to properly gender them.

This led to the full internet blitz and meme of "actually it's about ethics in games journalism" and games as art cover; because "neo nazi got dumped and now wants to create a hate movement to go after his ex" isn't really the noble cause he wanted it to be and even he knew it. 4chan was already in the middle of declaring women functionally evil as this was around the time of the rise of incels, and they had already begun targeting anita sarkeesian. even going so far as to...give her money? we'll get back to this stupid idea.

the rebranding was unfortunately very effective. reddit ate that shit up (that's what r/kotakuinaction was likely for; to reinforce the lie). it didn't help that being a corporate space, games journalism HAD struggled with bias. but not for sexual favors. giant bomb formed because game studios were holding review copies "hostage" for good reviews. the late jeff gertsmann, games journalist and founder of giant bomb, was fired for reasons related to this!

this...didn't seem to register though. oddly enough. because this happened in 2007, and even though gertsmann didn't come forward (likely for legal/nda reasons) about what happened until 2012, gamergate didn't really kick off until 2014. a 7 year gap between a point when everyone began to realize that ethics in games journalism really HAD been compromised... and gamergate insisting it had started. gertsmann creating giant bomb in direct opposition to this idea lead to a different games journalism landscape. 2012 was when polygon formed, even, predating the idea of gamergate in the first place. so there was already a push for this kind of thing before the dude even got dumped!

(fun fact; this is also the start of the rising star of the mcelroy brothers; justin and griffin mcelroy started at polygon as games journalists, but i digress.)

circling back to the "giving anita sarkeesian money was a 4chan op" thing, that organized a campaign to flood her fundraising for feminist frequency with money. why, you ask? because they're fucking stupid! oh and also they wanted the quality she intended to be lacking for the funding she got to "prove" she was a fraud. this worked but not how they wanted; because of the influx of funding she postponed the release to make sure it was worth what she got. the postponing was all they had, insisting she "stole the money", ignoring that she did eventually release the series as promised.

back to gamergate proper, however, steve bannon and i have one thing in common; we saw this shit happening in real time. so, him, being a scummy political leech, used it as an opportunity to kickstart a new, younger, more internet savvy far right movement. this is the reason 4chan is so inextricably connected to the far right these days, and why gaming as a whole is such a cesspool of far right dog whistles, yet why every far right dork seems to hate games journalism.

to summarize, it was never about ethics in games journalism or games as art. it's was a bitter dude who got turned on to neo-nazi bullshit, got dumped by his more successful partner, and handled it by getting laughed out of the something awful forums until 4chan snapped up the burgeoning hate movement and steve bannon gave it legs.


i was there. like, day 1. i was on the something awful forums as well as another, much smaller forum, where we laughed at these dorks.

i watched this shit happen in real time. it's INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT that we never forget that "ethics in games journalism" was the lie, and the POINT was always a harassment campaign against a queer creator who dumped him.

accidental-memory

I was not on SA and 4chan, but I was in the YouTube atheist community and I got to watch this bubble up through atheist and skeptic channels like thunderf00t who started making How Feminism Poisons Everything videos about Anita Sarkeesian. I didn't hear about Zoe Quinn et al until atheist chuds (distinguishing here from atheist non-chuds) started screaming about them.

Sarkeesian's Tropes vs Women (which first released in March) was THE SAME YEAR as Elevatorgate (which happened in June). What is Elevatorgate? Rebecca Watson, YouTuber and founder of Skepchick, did a presentation/speech at the World Atheist Convention in Dublin, Ireland. Later she was at the bar until deep into the morning hours, and when she went to go back to her room a man followed her onto the elevator to proposition her. This man, who was never named and didn't accost her, was turned down and then had to stand there awkwardly with her on her way to her floor. This prompted Watson to comment on the event on her periodical YouTube vlog:

I was a single woman, in a foreign country, at 4 a.m., in a hotel elevator with you—just you—and don't invite me back to your hotel room, right after I have finished talking about how it creeps me out and makes me uncomfortable when men sexualize me in that manner.

The community fucking flipped its shit. No less than Richard Dawkins wrote about it condescendingly in his "Dear Muslima" open letter. YouTuber Shaun recently released a (quite long) video about the book "The War On Science" where he addresses what happened and it's probably the best and most succinct telling + analysis I've ever heard (start at 57:30).

"... They ran head-first into feminism, bounced off it, and shattered apart. One problem is that many anti-feminist skeptics were used to arguing with soft targets. It's very easy to disprove, say, creationism by simply citing basic facts and evidence. ... [They] were used to first-round knockouts and never really had to go the distance before, and they just simply couldn't hack it."

One other point I think gets left out in this area, to the point that I am editing this to add it on even though it was half the point of me making this addition in the first place, is that in the skeptic community the overlap with the gamer community was pretty substantial, a lot of these speakers were regular attendees at Dragon*Con, and there was already a growing hostile debate about appropriate behavior and sex at conventions.

vreliskriri
tpwrtrmnky

One thing I think is important when talking about "egg culture" and online celebrities is realizing that there's a difference between "This pop singer might secretly be a lesbian" and "She is a lesbian who doesn't know it and it's our job, personally, to make her realize"

Which translates to the trans equivalent.

And none of those are equivalent to "if you personally know someone who shows signs of being an egg you can and should try and see if you can help with that, making a judgement call about what they, your personal friend, might be receptive to."

footsteps-on-the-dance-floor

☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️ The whole Egg thing is built on assuming that closeted people must not know themselves or understand themselves and it's so patronising

tpwrtrmnky

Eggs are a real type of trans person that exists and many trans people have benefited enormously from happening to come across the right stray bit of messaging that helped them realize, or having a friend help them navigate their feelings.

The problem with what I'm describing here is the parasocial part.

charlizetheronsbush-official

there’s a difference between “my guy friend with long hair and depression keeps posting about ranma” and “this youtuber i have never met with long hair and autism might be a girl so i’m gonna leave comments under his videos telling him to try estrogen”