i love you so much
Vex members of the Tharsis Reformation playing a game of cards
Destiny 2 [Bungie] | Tharsis Outpost, Cantina
The Science Behind the Sci-Fi of the Vex
Introduction
What are the Vex? A typical sci-fi robot race with ominous red optics, attempting to wipe out organic life and take over the universe?
Actually, no! They are an alien species of protozoa - organisms consisting of a single biological cell - piloting the bronze mechs that we fight during gameplay. They function like an artificial neural network, and interact with the quantum states of energy and matter in a way that transcends the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle.
Their goal is not to eradicate humans in the typical, Terminator-like sense; rather, it is to revert all complex life in the universe to its purest, simplest stable state. The Vex are operating under the biological imperative that the cause and effect of Darwin’s Theory of Evolution are reversed; that, rather than being a sequence of progress and improvement, the development of multicellular organisms was the result of a series of errors in a code that governs the universe. They are operating under the imperative that those errors have been stacking and compounding on each other ever since, and by reducing complex molecular structures to simpler forms, they are “debugging” that cosmic code.
But the Vex? The Vex seek neither Light nor Darkness. They seek Convergence, the reduction of all life to its simplest, most meaningless form. An entelechy of zeros and ones. █
Source: Kairos Function
Science Behind Sci-Fi: The Desert Perpetual (Part 2)
Continued from Part 1. Click here to view!
Agraios
A feature readily noticeable when entering the Agraios - a Hobgoblin whose name is Greek for “Hunter” - encounter are the five coils, resembling the electromagnets used in a particle accelerator.
Two circular coils, resembling the electromagnets of a particle accelerator, seen at the center of the Agraios encounter’s battlefield.
A real particle accelerator, used in the Integrable Optics Test Accelerator (IOTA) at Fermilab.
Image source: Fermilab Photowalk 2025. Click on image to view larger.
Electromagnets like these are used to influence the path of the particles, keeping it away from the walls of the accelerator and headed in the direction of its intended target: a detector, another particle that it is meant to collide with, etc. These electrically-charged coils align the particles– referenced in the raid by the “Alignment Charge” buff that a player stacks as they run through each coil.
After running through the coils, the player gains a buff called “Tachyon Alignment.” A tachyon is a type of hypothetical particle, now considered highly unlikely to exist. Its defining feature is that it travels faster than the speed of a photon in a vacuum– which would mean, from our understanding of time as a feature of relativistic physics, that it travels faster than the speed at which causality occurs.
One might wonder: why is the speed of a photon in a vacuum the speed at which causality occurs? Do photons have some special property that dictates the experience of causality? (No, they don’t– it’s causality that dictates the speed of photons.)
First, what is causality? It’s the physical experience that effect always follows cause, and never the other way around. A car will not spontaneously drive away before its engine has even been started. We do not age backward in time. We remember the past, and not the future.
We only experience effect after cause.
We know from special relativity that the passing of time is experienced relative to the observer. A fast-moving vehicle will pass a stationary vehicle faster than it passes a vehicle moving at half its speed, and it will not pass a vehicle moving beside it at the same speed.
Without an upper limit to this relativistic experience of time, there would be no causality. At the same speed, every observer would experience every event happening simultaneously. The universe would have instantly progressed from the Big Bang to thermal equilibrium.
The speed of a photon in a vacuum grounds this relativistic timeframe to causality because it is constant. This was first demonstrated experimentally by the Michelson-Morley Experiment, which - like Young’s Experiment - was meant to prove the existence of luminiferous aether. The experiment detected no change in the speed of light regardless of the angle of the measuring apparatus, or the movement of the source.
If light were an object with mass, one would expect the speed of light to vary with the speed of its source. Light emitted from the headlights of a moving car, for example, would be traveling faster (relative to a stationary observer) than light emitted from the headlights of a parked car. We now know that no such change in the speed of light is observed because light is composed of photons, and photons have no mass.
The fact that the speed of a photon in a vacuum remains constant, despite the movement (or lack thereof) of its emitter, is why it is so relevant in physically defining causality. This constant is not limited to photons; it applies to gravitational waves. It would apply to any massless particle; at present, the photon is the only massless particle which has been experimentally confirmed to exist.
Meanwhile, if an object that has mass were to approach the speed of a photon in a vacuum, the amount of energy needed to accelerate it would approach infinity. That is why objects with mass cannot travel at the speed of a massless particle.
The hypothetical tachyon has an imaginary mass (meaning that its mass squared is negative; therefore its mass is an imaginary number). Therefore they require energy to decelerate rather than accelerate. As a decelerating tachyon approaches the speed of a photon in a vacuum, the energy needed to decelerate it would approach infinity. Just as particles with mass cannot be accelerated to the speed of a photon in a vacuum, tachyons could not be decelerated to it.
If a tachyon were to send a signal that traveled faster than a photon in a vacuum, in some reference frames, it would arrive before it had left its destination. This opens the door to logical paradoxes such as the “Grandfather Paradox:” If a time traveler went back in time and killed their own grandfather before one of their parents was born, how could they exist to go back in time and kill their own grandfather?
The simplest solution is that tachyons do not exist. Perhaps they do exist, but we can never interact with them, and therefore they do not violate our experience of causality. If that is the case, we would never be able to study them scientifically.
Science Behind Sci-Fi: The Desert Perpetual (Part 1)
Introduction
While Destiny 2’s narrative is often dismissed as “space magic,” the fiction is meticulously woven into a real-world physics framework. Instead of contradicting existing science, the lore is based on the premise that we discover things in that universe which we simply haven’t discovered in real life.
Sometimes these are things we’re extremely unlikely to discover, like paracausality. Other times, the narrative highlights things that real scientists are actively searching for– such as dark matter.
Physicists have long been searching for GUTs and a ToE; that is, Grand Unifying Theories and a Theory of Everything. Physics is full of mysteries. Science is not truth in and of itself.
Rather, it is a method by which we discover truth: ask a question, suggest a hypothesis, test the hypothesis via experiment, and observe the results. Sometimes the technology doesn’t yet exist to allow us to conduct a particular experiment. Sometimes we don’t know the right question to ask, or the right hypothesis to suggest.
Classical, or Newtonian, physics best explains how things work on the scale in which we live our day-to-day lives. Quantum physics best explains how things work on the scale of atoms and subatomic particles. Relativistic physics best explains how things work on the scale of the cosmos.
All three of these theories have been repeatedly demonstrated to be true, and have practical applications that affect human lives: medical imaging technology such as the PET scan relies on antiparticles governed by quantum physics, and our GPS satellites rely on a relation to the Earth’s speed and gravity that is governed by relativistic physics.
However, the theories conflict with each other. In quantum physics, time is a background parameter and considered to be absolute, while in relativistic physics, time is relative, and one aspect of spacetime. At the moment, science does not have an answer as to why. Physicists are looking for a Theory of Everything: one single framework of physics that explains the entire universe.
This document is meant to break down the references to real-world physics found throughout the Desert Perpetual raid, in the hope that an audience without a detailed knowledge of physics can see and appreciate the depth of the game's worldbuilding as much as the author does.
For additional background on nonfictional science tied into Destiny 2’s Vex lore, see:
The Science Behind the Sci-Fi of the Vex
The CloudArk’s Relation to the Vex Network
Anonymous
Honestly wondering what the mechanics are behind the Vex gaining individuality because, as far as i remember, each Vex frame contains hundreds of Vex in its radiolaria. So i wonder if it acts sort of like a hive mind, a single consciousness shared between the Vex in the fluid
I’m interested in that too! I’d like them to go into it as much as possible when we get to meet the Vex criminals in Renegades.
It’s possible that it works that way, kinda like Mass Effect’s Geth I guess. Or maybe each frame just got solidified with whatever radiolaria was present, and then created an individual from that. Could be anything honestly!
Probably my favourite thing in the lore going forward, this evolution of the Vex.
I’ve been gone for a minute. Why do the vex have sick jackets now
They’re gaining individuality! It’s been going on for a while now, since the Conductor gained the Echo of Command back in episode Echoes and has been messing with the Vex. It resulted in them slowly becoming more individual. Really neat lore tab from back in Echoes that lists some of the stuff random Guardians noted about the Vex acting differently, with the fan favourite being:
Right as I was about to draw, the Hobgoblin waved its hand at me. I figured it was signaling an ambush and I looked around, but it didn’t have any backup. It waved again, and I gave it a little wave back—I didn’t see the harm. Well, it got real excited at that and waved with both arms.
This allowed them to be sometimes more efficient in combat because they have a better way of navigating fighting the Guardians (aka paracausality) if they are free to think individually. They began using actual combat tactics rather than just running at us, as well as making them better at simply processing stuff. Some voice lines from Ikora from Echoes about this and about the difference between the Vex she yoked and the Vex that essentially joined her on their own. Specifically with the Precursors, they aren’t yoked and manipulated through the Echo; rather they’re made more individual and then directed, like an army capable of following specific inputs, rather than mindless pawns.
It also leads to funny things like the Vex having direct beef with Guardians and swearing at us.
This isn’t always beneficial for the Conductor as a section of them have begun rejecting her and her commands, and moving on their own. The problem with individuality is that the Vex are beginning to make their own choices and some of them do not align with what the Conductor wants. An interesting one is from the raid lore book where a Hobgoblin decides to be an artist and the Conductor… Doesn’t like it one bit:
A Hobgoblin holds up useless, shining pieces of scrap to weld to its body. Its hand is very steady as it applies the solder.
TELL ME WHY.
Its hand jerks back. It lifts its face as a sunflower to that which gives it life.
V^ directive(original/HOBGOBLIN)==observe==judge==enact || IF(independent)=true THEN directive(modified/HOBGOBLIN(independent))==observe==create==build (self, other, beauty) ^V
An aspiring artist? Useless. A waste of mind.
The Conductor drains it of radiolaria and destroys it. This is not the only time this happened, so for individualistic minds that the Vex are becoming, this might’ve contributed to them breaking away from her command. If she wants them to be individuals, she should treat them as such, right?
The lore book we get for collecting datapads also adds to this, letting us know that the Vanguard and Guardians are well aware of the Vex slowly breaking away from the Conductor; at least some of them:
Dedicated observation of the Nessian Schism leads me to believe that Maya’s control over the Echo of Command has begun to dwindle. I witnessed several groups of Vex roaming in loose bands, seemingly without patrol routes. I saw one Goblin sit on the ground and watch an insect with childlike interest for some time.
I discovered a group of Choral Vex frames, devoid of life, warped and twisted, driven into the ground like corpse daffodils in early spring. They were drained of radiolaria, perhaps in a punitive measure. If the Conductor is forced to mete out such draconian punishment, then her hold over the Collective must truly be imperiled.
Probably the most damning is this lore tab where the Vex actively and directly tell the Conductor that she’s not welcome anymore:
-The Collective has processed your threats-
-You flee to Vex networks and attempt to claim sovereignty over our Minds-
-The Collective is uninterested in your ambitions-
-You will tap the fourth dimension and exhaust your usefulness-
-The Collective executes a response-
-Return and be Expunged-
So, now that some of the Vex are individual and can think for themselves and have interests and personalities for themselves, they rejected the Conductor and some of them have decided it’s time to wear clothes and form a criminal syndicate on Mars. Honestly, one of the most realistic scenarios for them. What to do with their free time? Crime of course.
One of the most exciting developments in the recent stuff for me. Everything with the Vex and their changes has been a delight, I can’t wait to see where else it leads.
In the middle of my 18 lore tabs opened and DLV still not having uploaded the Edge of Fate sidequests, I forgot... Sharp Cheddar. I had to go find the quest somewhere in the folder with my 4000 screenshots.
We found a Vex friend on Kepler! It calls itself Sharp Cheddar. I would kill and die for Sharp Cheddar. It specifically came to us to ask for help. It wanted us to help fake its death so that it could escape the Conductor and be its own person.
We left it with the Aionians to look after it.
Anonymous
So with everything we found out this dlc with time travel this dlc (edge of fate) what does all this mean for the vex. Are all the future and past times we've traveled with them all simulations then? We know things can be pulled from the past into the future but is that a power the vex can control it seems like it was implied the nine only have these kinda powers. But also in the house of wolves skolass plan was to pull the fallen to the future using the vex tech. I feel like if the vex had access to this technology the conductor wouldn't have needed the nine. Essentially the vex are vexing me and I was hoping you would be able to provide some insight
Forgor about this ask!!!
I’ve been very intrigued by this as well. The Vex, despite being so closely linked with time and being able to do various shenanigans with it, always seemed somewhat limited with what they could do. You know, Drifter’s “If the Vex can time travel, maybe they’ve already won.” But they didn’t so what’s up with that?
Obviously a big issue for them is paracausality, something they can’t work around, so that might still be a big obstacle that’s preventing them from doing what Maya wanted. It’s also possible that now that we’re beginning to know more about the Nine, our understanding of the Vex will also change. They definitely seem to work more through simulations and alternate timelines than proper time travel which was always interesting to me. Looking forward to learning more! I hope that a lot of the stuff during this saga will revolve around the Vex.
Skolas is actually an interesting thing to mention here in this context because, prior to his plan on Venus, he spent time with the Nine. Mara sent him to the Nine and they returned him for reasons unknown and then he developed this whole plan with the Vex on Venus. Peculiar in retrospect!
The Vex are absolutely vexing and we generally don’t know as much about them as we’d like. They can observe and simulate timelines, even move through them, but overall don’t seem to be capable of truly and completely making alterations to it, especially not backwards. Paracausality is a huge stopping block for them as well. Their tech is powerful, but it’s usually used in some way modified. Genuinely the only example of bizarre time travel (backwards) I can think of is us with the Perfect Paradox, the Sundial and the Corridors of Time. It’s unclear how much of that was possible purely due to Vex tech or the combination of Vex tech, whatever Osiris used to power the Sundial and our paracausal link to Saint.
Excited for more on the Vex and their changes and how this all will fit in with the Nine which, by far, seem to be more powerful.
I wrote a detailed post about the Vex, and what kind of interactions with the world around them they are lore-capable of, here: The Science Behind the Sci-Fi of the Vex
Let's take a more specific look at time travel.
I've seen a lot of people, across a variety of social media platforms, talking about how Edge of Fate "retconned" the Vex: that they used to be capable of traveling backward and forward within a single timeline, and now they are only capable of timeline-hopping.
I think people who aren't as invested in the story's references to real-world physics, specifically, have missed the fact that the existence of multiple realities has been canon in the Destiny universe since at least the Books of Sorrow lore: The Ascendant Plane, where the Hive have their throne worlds, is a reality outside of the one that the game takes place in. The Hive draw their power from another alternate reality, in which a symbol becomes the literal thing that it represents. Crota cut open a path into an alternate reality, which is what allowed the Vex into the one in which the game takes place.
The Beyond Light DLC made the Many-Worlds Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics canon to the Destiny universe: every single possible outcome exists, in a separate timeline. The Mysterious Logbook took a deep dive into the scientific and technical nuances of Vex technology: Vex gates are Ellis wormholes; Vex organisms are capable of interacting directly with states of quantum superposition in ways that transcend the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle...
There are several different modes and forms of time travel in science-fiction. Many-Worlds Interpretation, or "timeline-hopping," is one type of time travel: each change that's made in a timeline results in a divergent timeline, which exists separate from the original timeline. Time travel does not have to take the form of "this always happened," in which the act of time travel itself is what sets the entire story into motion in a cyclical loop. Overview of different types of time travel in science-fiction writing here!
So... I don't think the Destiny writing "retconned" anything. Multiple realities has been canon since at least 2014. Not every character is a physicist, and so not every character would know that- case in point, Drifter wondering how the Vex haven't won already.
Now, what do the Vex actually do as far as interacting with timelines, and how does it relate to what the Nine are doing in Edge of Fate?