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Omg he absolutely will lmao
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what if orpheus looked back at eurydice and then orpheus got fucking decked to the ground because they were playing a hockey game and you have to look where you’re going
the way my heart was in my THROAT
the way ilya must have been thinking "if he weren't looking back at me, this wouldn't have happened"
the way shane's first thought was that ilya was going to worry about him
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outside of the obvious reasons why the hollanov relationship reveal must be crazy to shane’s parents, it’s gotta be wild to them that their shy, awkward kid is dating the league slut. their kid, who cannot even say the word “sex” without blushing, has been fucking a man whose sexual reputation is a topic of conversation. for a decade. they are in fact on a sexcation together. if you want to see them, you need to text them that you’re on your way there, because even if they know you’re coming in advance, they cannot keep their hands off of each other long enough to properly keep track of time. david hollander sees things start to heat up between them and knows instantly that they have probably fucked against every window in that extremely glass house.
idk i’m obsessed with how shane bringing ilya home is not just him coming out as gay, it’s him coming out as an experienced sex freak.
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Also as someone who didn’t read the books and based on what I’ve seen I don’t want to, would you feel comfortable talking about how the books discuss Shane being asian vs the show?
I don’t know if comfortable is the word. It’s just, I’m white so. How valuable my input would be is debatable. Take it with a grain of salt.
(I also know a lot of people have talked about it in other posts. Most of what I would say I think others have said.)
Reid makes Shane think of himself as boyish. She weirdly emphasizes how smooth and hairless he is. She says he can’t grow a full beard. She will state that Shane isn’t truly short yet makes him short in comparison to all the other players (he’s 5’10, Ilya is 6’3) and then talks about him like he’s short. She had Ilya comment on his smoothness and pick on him for being short. She makes him obsessed with Ilya’s manliness in a way that may just be her trying make it clear how gay he is but something about it is gross to me still (both gross for him and for Ilya frankly). I haven’t come across anything that feminizes him yet, but I have seen multiple others say that happens. In no other way does she explore Shane being Asian. She doesn’t write it as having any impact on him in the NHL. She doesn’t really even acknowledge the existence of racism nor explore how being Asian would influence his sense of self or his worldview.
As for the show, they obviously did a better job by you know, acknowledging it. At all. lol. Like at multiple points throughout the show they make a purposeful point to show that Shane experiences racism in the MLH. Do I think it is the most accurate depiction of racism? Not really. It’s a little stiff. Racism is a lot more insidious in real life. But the effort is there. There’s also a nod to his Japanese heritage in the last episode - a lot of people aren’t realizing it, but when Shane tries to stop Ilya from eating, it’s because his mom - the host - hasn’t begun eating/drinking yet, which is a Japanese custom. Obviously Ilya doesn’t know that’s why Shane stopped him, so he just keeps eating lmao. But, there was an effort to be like hey, Shane is half Japanese. Again, it feels a little stiff to me. Not unrealistic exactly, but very obviously put in for a purpose if that makes sense.
I think both of them are kind of ignoring the elephant in the room, which is that Shane’s mom is Asian and this adds layers of complexity to her role in his life as his momager. I couldn’t begin to detail the nuances of that, but the point is it definitely changes things, and they can’t avoid it changing things by simply refusing to address it, which it appears both tried to do - to me, personally.
Also, I hate the “It’s probably where you get your looks from” line. I wish Tierney hadn’t kept it. It feels gross to me to have Ilya tell Shane he gets his looks from his mom specifically because she’s Asian. Or maybe that wasn’t the intended implication, I don’t know, but it’s all I hear, and it feels a little fetishistic. Definitely exotifying at least.
Appreciate your input! Definitely will need to find peoples analysis on Shane’s Asian identity (or lack thereof) in the books. I knew about the lack of racism in the books but the boyish part is new to me and yikes.
Also I do like the show adding much more with the reporters only comparing Shane to Serena Williams and tiger woods, the diversity comment when he got drafted, the Rolex comment. Hopefully they actually delve into it more s2
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i really really do hope that however they adapt the long game they do address shane's eating disorder as a serious issue especially since i do not think the source material and as a result readers are at all empathetic to the fact that shane is struggling just as much as ilya as a mentally disordered athlete and even perhaps for just as long considering shane's possible preexisting aversions to food stemming from his autism as well as having normalized this behavior for the entirety of his life he and ilya have been under the spotlight for their whole life and they both deserve to be afforded understanding and kindness :(
actually you know what rachel saying shane didnt have an eating disorder pissed me off so bad like what do you mean. what do you mean. even if its sponsored by the team it is extremely common in sports for sporting organizations to be single handedly responsible for developing and/or encouraging an eating disorder see sambo 70 and eteri's girls subsiding only on water see valterri bottas developing an eating disorder due to the pressure of being the second seat mercedes etc.
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God I wish I could agree with literally any of the praise this fandom is showering down on Yuna, but like, I can't, and it is getting really annoying seeing people constantly praise her for things she indisputably should be criticized for, or at least not applauded for. What do you mean it was funny when she switched into momager mode and started talking about all the possible brand deals her son could get before even asking him if he wanted to come out. What do you mean she's such a good mom for only caring about whether or not Shane had ever let Ilya win. What do you mean she will always be "famous" for adjusting her son's wet shirt to make him look sexier in an ad he's visibly uncomfortable participating in. What the fuck. What the fuck. Where am I. I feel insane. Just because she's not as bad of a parent as Ilya's dad, just because she loves her son, just because she doesn't overtly abuse him, does not mean she's a good parent and it's okay to fucking say that! It's okay if she's not perfect! It actually makes the story a lot better if she's not!
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So, as a disclaimer here, I should disclose that I was primed to dislike Yuna before I even started watching. The moment I knew she was his manager, I was like "Oh, this is a really problematic and unhealthy dynamic for someone to have with their parent, and in real life, it's unlikely that relationship could exist without any trace of abuse." That made it so that from like, frame 1 of the TV show I was already viewing her through a very different lens than most of the audience possibly was.
The other thing that made me kind of primed to dislike her, is that in real life, Shane's life would have been as dictated by being pushed into hockey by his parents as Ilya's was. Yes, Shane really wanted to go into hockey, but it doesn't change the fact that his entire childhood after the moment it was clear he was good enough to go pro (I'm guessing Yuna made that discovery) was hockey and preparing to be a hockey player. It's possible - in real life, this happens - that Shane was raised from day one to go into the exact sport his mom was obsessed with. Parents do that. The show doesn't say Yuna did that, but, realistically...I don't know. I think it's a hell of a coincidence that Yuna is the world's biggest Metros fan and eats, breathes and lives for hockey and then she happens to have a son that is a gifted enough hockey player to not only go pro but be the number 2 draft pick. In romance, coincidences like that can exist without it implying anything further, but even if we rule out Yuna raising her son to be a pro hockey player from birth, she is undoubtedly the person who made it happen after his talent was discovered and that would have seriously fucked up Shane's childhood experience.
The other thing is that she pretty obviously cares more about Shane's hockey career than she cares about his wellbeing. Do you think she's ever asked her son how he feels doing those commercials? I don't. We only get the tiniest of snippets from a montage of him doing them, and even we can see that he's fucking miserable in them, and deeply uncomfortable in them. I have a different post I'm going to post that talks about this more, but it's pretty obvious she prioritizes his brand and career over his wellbeing and doesn't appear to ask him how he feels about that. At that one lunch where she's pressuring him to go to Wimbledon, she seems surprised that he's being so noncompliant and it still isn't enough to make her fully back off. (David isn't innocent here either btw, he's just significantly less problematic because he's not managing Shane).
Granted, you can argue that these types of things are part of the deal of being a hockey player. I'm sure they are. But to this extent? We don't see Ilya doing anywhere near as much shit like that (If any? The only thing I can think of is his likeness on the game. Or I suppose, talking to the minister in Russia). And then on top of that, even if it is necessary, nothing is stopping Yuna from talking to her son about it, empathizing with him, viewing it as a necessary evil - but she doesn't.
And then there's the fact that Shane is tokenized as an Asian player. And I'll say right away that in most cases, I wouldn't dream of arguing I know how Yuna should respond to seeing her son tokenized or argue that she is responding the wrong way. I don't know. I know that in that first scene we get where Shane is told that they're so happy to have an Asian-Canadian player, there was basically no winning. Nothing they could have said or done about the racism there in that moment would have ended well.
But one moment where she absolutely could have done better was when Shane said "Does less tennisy mean less white?" (or whatever he says). I just think...how can you hear your son say, or imply, that the racism he's experiencing doing all of this branding and publicity shit is evidently taking its toll, is making him feel tokenized - and not immediately shift gears? How can you hear him say that and not immediately go, "You're right. You don't have to do it." I might be completely out of line on this one. I'm sorry if I am. But from where I'm sitting, I felt so betrayed on Shane's behalf in that moment because his mom should understand. She's really the only person in his life he can or would choose to go to with something like that (at that time, at least) and she wasn't there for him. She didn't even acknowledge the validity of his statement.
And then there's the family dinner where he comes out to her. She says the exact perfect thing to him outside ("I'm sorry I made you feel like you couldn't tell me") but then immediately becomes momager again in the cottage, talking about all the branding opportunities Shane could get before even fucking asking him if he wants to come out. She also asks Shane if he ever let Ilya win? Which is like, first of all, you think you know your son so well but then at the same time think he might have ever let Ilya win? Lmao? But also it's just like, that's your concern? That shouldn't have even crossed her mind. That should not be what's important to her in that moment.
And then she says "But that's so sad" when Shane says he plans on keeping his relationship with Ilya hidden. And look, this is very run-of-the-mill homophobia for accepting parents, and I actually appreciate its inclusion. Not all homophobia is slurs and kicking kids out. Sometimes it's just incredible obliviousness. But it's there nonetheless, and she remains oblivious. I don't think Yuna is going to be unlearning any of her own homophobia because she doesn't think she's homophobic. And again - this is a very realistic representation of what homophobia from accepting parents can look like. I like it. But I wish the fandom would acknowledge it for what it is: fucking homophobia.
This is why I have a problem with the "I'm sorry you felt like you couldn't tell me" conversation. It was added specifically to maintain the queer-joy ending Tierney was going for, and to give a cathartic fantasy to all the queer viewers who all their life have needed to hear their parents say the same thing - and there's nothing wrong with that, and it's beautiful. But I don't fucking buy it. The Yuna outside is a different fucking Yuna than the one in the cottage, and very visibly so. The Yuna in the cottage would never consider for a moment that she played any role in her son not telling her, and I honestly think that Yuna would feel hurt and offended that Shane didn't tell her. I think that Yuna would even feel entitled to knowing and feel like she was the one being slighted for not being told.
Anyway. This isn't even exhaustive I don't think,but I'm aware my view of her is thoroughly tarnished by the fact that my struggle here is that I just can't suspend my disbelief as high as the story needs me to.
But the last thing I will say is that my point here really isn't that she's a "bad" mom. The point here is not to insist she's actually a villain. She's not. She's clearly not.
My point here is that she's not fucking perfect. She's actually, in my opinion, a very realistic representation of what your typical "good" mom looks like, because in real life, even good parents are flawed and fuck you up in ways they never intended and can't conceive of. I think part of the reason I'm also so biased against her is because she reminds me of my own mom, who I love dearly and would do anything for, lmao. Yuna is doing her best, she's good in many ways, she loves her son deeply, she has only the best of intentions - and at the same time she's oblivious, cares too much about the wrong things, and ends up neglecting or hurting him without meaning to in ways that are nevertheless unfair to Shane.
I very much agree with all of this, though if I could add my two cents I would like to point out a few things that could explain her actions a little more. Again, I'm not saying this makes her actions good (I fully agree with you that this is an unhealthy dynamic and very much doesn't take Shane's comfort or mental wellbeing into consideration), but it is some explanation. This is, of course, also just my interpretation.
I moved to the country we currently live in when I was little, and my parents pushed me very hard on a lot of things, though primarily academics and sports. I think this is the case for a lot of immigrant children, or children with immigrant parents. Excellence as a shield, which is understandable. What's even more important in Shane's case, though, is that sports is community. Sports is culture. Sports is acceptance. Yuna gave her son a western name, there is no indication that Shane speaks Japanese (in the series, at least, I haven't read the books), everything she does is centered around making him fit in. My parents pushed me into sports, particularly team sports, because they tend to work as an assimilation tool. You make friends like that, you meet other kids, you meet their parents, you're less foreign. It doesn't always work well, you're always different, but it makes you less racialised. I can fully see a young Yuna, adapting and assimilating, giving her son the shield of a Western name, refusing to teach him a different language (especially in schools, teachers tended to discourage multilingualism in the past, especially with very foreign languages), and putting him in a team sport where he could make white friends and be shielded. The sport which made her feel Canadian. The sport that helped her fit in.
Then, Shane has talent, shows promise, he can be better, he can not just blend in, he can shine. I see it as a survival tactic, pushing him towards greatness, towards excellence, especially in this sport. It's not healthy, because parents like this are demanding and they are invasive and they are controlling (my own are! very much so). Yuna, who is Japanese and an immigrant and knows that her son needs shielding from the systemic injustices around them, pushes him to that, and when he becomes a professional, she controls that too. She controls the image, she makes sure he's visible, popular, successful, rich. She makes sure he's untouchable. Does it matter that he's uncomfortable? Tokenized? Maybe, yeah, sure, but does it? Not really, if it becomes his shield. I'm not saying that it's a healthy dynamic at all, and I definitely think her being his manager crosses a lot of personal boundaries, but I see where it's coming from. Maybe I'm also comparing her to my own mother, I suppose.
On the homophobia side of it, I do fully agree. Though I don't 100% agree with the Yuna outside being so different from her inside, when I look at it with the lens of my own personal experiences. My own mother has cried and apologise for being so controlling and overbearing (out of love) that I have hidden things from her out of fear of disappointing her (though, yes, as you said, after blowing up and not seeing how it could be her fault... and then having time to process and understanding that it was), and then she goes right back to pushing in the same way she always does. I don't think it's inconsistent because... that is what parents like this are like, often. It's a defense mechanism and they can't actually turn it off.
I do still not like that she's Shane's manager, even if I understand the narrative. Its implications are just not handled properly because the source material doesn't handle it properly, I assume, just like Shane's eating disorder and Ilya's depression. I may just be giving this my own immigrant family in a racist country twist, but yeah.
I feel like I need to reiterate something that was lost in my initial response:
People seem to be under the impression I think there’s no in-universe reason Yuna is like this that’s understandable or empathetic. That is not the case.
My problem is that because there are understandable and empathetic reasons Yuna is like this, the fandom has decided to view her with zero nuance and act like she’s perfect.
I am simply refusing to do so, because I find her character a lot more enjoyable when I acknowledge the nuance of her as an imperfect parent.
Also Shane is getting Yuna as his manager before he makes it to the NHL!! She’s there watching the other players at tryouts, asking him why he’s not paying attention!! It’s framed to show Shane has support and Ilya doesn’t but what Shane has is pressure!! He’s doing brand deals at 19? 20? By his mom!! At that age just because you’re legally an adult doesn’t mean you actually have a say in what you do especially not when you have your mom as your professional tether and your dad supporting her!!
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Anonymous asked:
your rant about yuna makes me want a scene where shane asks her to stop being his manager for a bit and just be his mom
I would love it if they did something like that. I think there would need to be conflict leading up to it for a while but I also frankly think that would be good for the story too. Now that Shane knows his sexuality, he needs his own side conflict the way Ilya is going to have in season 2. Part of me thinks that was the intention behind making Yuna his manager, but Tierney is so loyal to the book otherwise that I also kind of doubt it. Still, there is a lot of potential for a really rich side story about Shane realizing that his mom had not been the best mom to him since becoming his manager, and wanting to change that. I’ll honestly be kind of irritated if they introduced Yuna as his mom and do absolutely nothing more with it. I don’t know. We’ll see. My fingers are crossed! 🤞
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As a queer person who has had this kind of conversation with my straight mother, I'm obsessed with Ilya's reaction to Yuna saying he and Shane staying in the closet and keeping their relationship a secret for the rest of their careers is sad. That feeling when someone's catching up to your lived experience over the last decade.
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yknow what i think about all the time?
“montreal is nice, yes?”
“boston is nice too?”
he was just a kid and he was genuinely trying to connect with a peer and someone who had reached out to him and he felt a genuine connection to and he was looking for comfort and reassurance that he had made a good decision and would be happy
Just one tiny thing to add, a player doesn't have any control where they're drafted, the teams pick. So it isn't so much a decision he made as a whole bunch of things out of his control happening to him all at once. He could've ended up anywhere based on draft picks that year, and he ended up in Boston, a city he's never been to in a country he doesn't know well that speaks a language he isn't fluent in. And he asks "This'll be okay, right? This place I'm going, it's nice? I'll be okay there?" And Shane says yes and then here, finally, is someone he trusts telling him it's an okay place to go.
And Shane drinks when Ilya tells him. That detail is as important as anything else. Pretty much everything is out of Ilya’s control except this weirdo who’s staring at his crotch. Shane, meanwhile, is at the absolute height of “PLEASE TELL ME I’M A GOOD BOY I AM TRYING SO HARD I WILL DRINK WATER.” He’s so young, too, and practically ready to dive face-first into Ilya’s sweaty groin if it means getting to shut his brain off for two seconds.
Yes, all this. And I simply MUST peer review the tags, because they’re stellar.
First off, @jahsontodd
Next we have @thoughtfulgardenerpirate
Then @agoodsoldier and @parcai
And next @mybloodstream-caffeine
Next up @tsitpfrvrbonrad although I must correct them. When they first met in December 2008, Ilya and Shane were only 17. The draft was June 2009, and Ilya’s date of birth is June 15, 1991. So they had both just become legal adults (Shane’s is May 10, 1991). Depending on when in June the draft was held, Ilya might have still been 17 in the gym scene.
Then we have @myarchiveforme and @bedalk
Just below we have @swords-n-spindles who is breaking my heart into tiny pieces. This cute Canadian boy with the freckles is the first person in North America Ilya has had a positive interaction with. But the league, their new teams, and the media have decreed that they should have a professional rivalry.
So they can’t be friends. And even though Ilya was already attracted to Shane here, I think he would’ve settled for a platonic friendship with the first kind person he’d met on this continent. If that was all that was on offer. But he can’t even have that, because that would ruin the heated rivalry narrative their new bosses are busily constructing around these two teenagers.
Neither of whom are yet old enough to drink legally in most provinces (in BC and Ontario, at least, it’s 19). They’re just barely old enough to vote. Not that I think voting matters much in Russia, but you know what I mean.
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Anonymous asked:
shane nuzzling into ilya's crotch...ilya nuzzling into shane's armpit...is this something
two alphas scent-marking themselves via nuzzling into the other's scent glands... you don't see this kind of a/a intimacy represented on screen very often but i think it's beautiful and a sign of how far we've come as a society
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The skip episode frames a secret relationship as a cage and the cottage episode frames a secret relationship as a refuge, a sanctuary, a spoon to carve a tunnel to freedom out from the confines of your actual cage. This is why the skip episode ain't shit.
(tags from @fenix-estrafalario)
I can't tell you how fucking insane it made me that he wouldn't just tell people he was dating someone in the closet. My op post was just about how offensive the premise of that episode is to me personally but genuinely the writing in ep. 3 is so much worse too.
(tags from @ninety6tears)