Avatar

bloom and rot and bloom and rot and bloom and

@serregon / serregon.tumblr.com

CANCER FREE 7/31/2024 đŸ„ł
she/her ✔ 25+ ✔ gmt -5 ✔ đŸ–€đŸ©¶đŸ€đŸ’œ
metal, fantasy, horror, and tragedy are my sisters ✔ tĂșrin turambar’s okayest soldier ✔ header by @essenceofarda ✔ icon by @sauroff

i LOVE the idea of "i can't win, but you can lose" in fictional confrontations it is SO fucking tasty. the human nature to self destruct and the human nature to survive by any means necessary combined at its finest.

I will never get over the fact that the official pokemon tumblr account came back from a seven year hiatus because they found out that people on tumblr want to get the hobo from the it’s been 3000 years meme pregnant. i need to know how that conversation at tpc went. who’s the mad lad who asked for the tumblr password to get in on that gilf propaganda

Some of you think of Cops as kind of a symbolic figure representing "telling you what to do" & you're Posting things like "acab includes fandom discourse" and I thuink the 80% white website needs to remember the reason why we hate cops is because they kill people

We hate cops because they're a weapon for enforcing the state's interests through violence. Like, they kill & imprison people. The antis don't have a Quite Literal boot on your neck please god log off or talk to a Black person or something

To be SO fair like really generous there is something to be said for unlearning the habit of figuratively "policing" other people especially in the context of, like, not being a fucking snitch, "kill the cop in your head" etc etc, but can we not completely lose the plot re: what cops Are

Avatar
Reblogged

If I think about the symbolism with Floette's mega too hard I start feeling crazy ... The flower mega evolves while floette is unable to grow, unable to change due to her revival ... Forever a little girl, the flower wraps around her like an umbilical cord .... At the same time, Floette is symbolic of a mother's love; the imagery brings to mind how love can blossom and grow, but also how it can be smothering and stifling. The flower itself has become massive, and heavy. It is her anchor, weighing her down and keeping her bound to her past. But it is also her strength. Without her flower, she cannot protect those she loves, something she is well aware of. The ultimate weapon was built in the shape of the flower, but when it mega evolved it embodies that appearance even more, this weapon of mass destruction associated with an incredibly deep love.

Red in the context of the game-- the colour of destruction, of death, of chaos. Blue, life-giving, light, a symbol of growth. The flower now embodies both. It is Xerneas and Yveltal, Life and Death, and like AZ himself a symbol of duality.

The fact that she's gazing so apprehensively at the flower (which is literally overshadowing her) makes me want to blow up and die btw đŸ„č and she's so small in comparison rjdoejsoejsks

at least TĂșrin was like “ew no I’m killing myself now” when he found out he was related to NiĂ«nor. Brandir found out that she was his cousin three times over and was like cool I’m still gonna chase down her ghost

Avatar
Reblogged

morgoth: welcome to the fuck tĂșrin club, where we say “fuck you” to tĂșrin

beleg, sweating: i have severely misunderstood this club’s objective

Avatar
Reblogged

Death of NinĂ­el from this AU fic by @cuarthol https://archiveofourown.org/works/43814328 (WARNING, somewhat graphic)

Was going to draw TĂșrin as well but it didn’t turn out as well as I wanted 😭 I hope you like this!! It really was such a moving scene that I felt compelled to draw it. I hope I’ve adequately got the idea across that the image of Glaurung is a sort of apparition here, representing NinĂ­el. RIP NinĂ­el, girl you can’t get a break 😔

Avatar
Reblogged

If you have time or feel like answering, I’d like to hear your thoughts on how much of Turin’s tragic life issues are the result from the curse, versus how much from the consequences of his actions, and how much does his belief that he is cursed play a part?

Avatar

a very good question that I don’t really have a solid answer for. ultimately I think that the curse was deliberately written to be somewhat ambiguous.

looking at TĂșrin’s mistakes, some of the awful things he did were definitely more accidental than others. TĂșrin had never actually met NiĂ«nor before finding an amnesiac NĂ­niel. how was he supposed to know that this was his long-lost sister, who was supposed to be in Doriath?

TĂșrin stabbed Beleg because it was dark and stormy outside and he was suddenly awoken by a blade cutting his foot. when you’re stabbed in your sleep while you’re imprisoned at a torture camp, I don’t think your first thought is going to be “oh good my friend is here to save me. by stabbing me.”

these sorts of events can easily be chalked up to the curse or the actions of Glaurung. Glaurung wiped NiĂ«nor’s memories and sent her in TĂșrin’s direction. and killing Beleg definitely wasn’t TĂșrin’s intention. in the latter case, the narrator supports the reading that this was the fault of the curse; see the wording of “but fate was that day more strong”, implying that the curse caused Beleg’s knife to slip and cut TĂșrin

(side note: I question if TĂșrin and NiĂ«nor fell in love naturally and it was all just a really unfortunate and unintentional coincidence, or if their marriage was designed as part of Morgoth’s plan. we already know that Glaurung can influence minds psychically, it wouldn’t be too much of a stretch to say that his skill set includes love spells. Glaurung is cancelled for shipping incest.)

yet there are other events that feel much less ambiguous. TĂșrin killed Brandir. this wasn’t self defense, nor was it a case of mistaken identity. just straight up murder. TĂșrin also disregarded Aerin’s claims that killing Brodda would only bring about more trouble—basically claiming that he knew more about his aunt’s abuse than she did—and this results in her suicide. TĂșrin was told by elves who had received direct messages from the gods that Nargothrond would only stand if it were to remain hidden, and he still stubbornly insisted that Nargothrond must reveal itself.

this is where the “TĂșrin’s fault vs the curse’s fault” argument gets murky. did Morgoth force TĂșrin to kill Brandir? if he did, does that mean TĂșrin ever actually had free will? let’s look at how Morgoth himself describes the curse:

But upon all whom you love my thought shall weigh as a cloud of Doom, and it shall bring them down into darkness and despair. Wherever they go, evil shall arise. Whenever they speak, their words shall bring ill counsel. Whatsoever they do shall turn against them. They shall die without hope, cursing both life and death.

Morgoth actually does influence TĂșrin’s actions. I disagree with the idea that TĂșrin has no free will since everything was actually Morgoth’s doing, and that none of his actions could be considered his fault, yet Tolkien does outright tell us that TĂșrin really wasn’t the only person influencing TĂșrin’s worst mistakes. and we know that Glaurung too can directly influence TĂșrin’s mind, seeing how Glaurung made TĂșrin run away from the battle of Nargothrond by overpowering his mind and convincing him that his mother and sister needed his help more than Finduilas.

the “TĂșrin’s fault vs the curse’s fault” argument can lead to two very different opinions. on one side, you can argue that Brandir’s death wasn’t TĂșrin’s fault because Morgoth forced him to do it. on the other side, you can argue that TĂșrin is a cruel man who uses the idea of a curse as an excuse for his selfish actions.

both sides have their poor-pissing pitfalls. if nothing was ever really TĂșrin’s fault, then that honestly makes TĂșrin a rather boring character, more of a puppet being pulled along Morgoth’s string than a multi-dimensional character capable of thinking for himself. he wouldn’t be a character who does things, he’d just be a character that things happen to. and if you think the curse isn’t real and just an excuse, then, well that’s just stupid because we the readers are literally present in the scene where Morgoth lays his curse on him. like this is a fantasy world where a dinosaur can factory reset a woman, but you draw the line at the idea that curses exist in this story.

I think the influence of the curse was more of an urge than a compelling force upon TĂșrin. Morgoth was a force in TĂșrin’s mind, a sort of anti-conscience or a gut feeling. TĂșrin was never forced against his will to do anything awful, but his immediate gut reaction to certain situations came from Morgoth’s malice. TĂșrin doesn’t have to do anything Morgoth wants him to do, it’s just very hard to resist. I’m imagining it being kind of like the dark urge in bg3, or the cartoon trope of the devil on your shoulder.

the answer lies somewhere in the middle of the fate vs free will question. but what does “the middle” mean? how much does the curse really influence TĂșrin’s mind? can TĂșrin be blamed for some actions more than others? did the curse affect TĂșrin’s personality? was the curse a mental illness? it’s up to the reader to decide.

(having read some takes in this fandom, I could just take the cheap route and say that everything that my blorbo supposedly did wrong was actually just that dastardly Pengolodh slandering my precious pookie bear. um akshually we don’t know if TĂșrin really killed Saeros or if it’s just in-universe propagandaâ˜ïžđŸ€“)

Avatar

I feel it's also interesting to point out, when one looks into TĂșrin's actions, this passage too: "Therefore TĂșrin abode with the outlaws, since the company of any men made the hardship of the wild more easy to endure; and because he wished to live and could not be ever at strife with them, he did little to restrain their evil deeds. Thus he soon became hardened to a mean and often cruel life, and yet at times pity and disgust would wake in him, and then he was perilous in his anger. In this evil and dangerous way TĂșrin lived to that year's end and through the need and hunger of winter, until stirring came and then a fair spring"

Now, of course, I fully understand he was a man alone in the wilds needing to survive, but there are ways to at least attempt survival without enabling and eventually even joining an "evil and dangerous way" of living, of men who are described to assault Men, Elf and Dwarf alike with little care. There is, in him, as a throughline in the story, a touch of cruelty by character. Even in the way he goes after Saeros, there is a flavour of sadism. He draws the line, later, at enabling sexual assault, however - which is interesting, and I feel meant to prove he has a moral pith/some underlying principles. I think he is still meant to be primarily a heroic figure - if also tragic and fallen - but even aside from a few seminal "turning point" acts he is, overall and in various implied ways, a man very accepting of cruelty and rule-of-force, in ways that I would struggle to attribute to Morgoth or a curse. At least not fully.

Jumping on what antlered-vixen has said, I think it's also interesting to note how Morgoth could be leveraging TĂșrin's traits for his own ends. In regard to the curse I think this could come about in a few ways: 1) The curse in part may be enacted by circumstances that discourage TĂșrin's impulses to be tempered.

2)HĂșrin may actually the primary audience for the "curse" discourse. We see during the unrest of the Noldor in Aman that Morgoth is a skilled and subtle manipuator, who both understands the behaviour and psychology of incarnates and is very good at deploying this knowledge for his own ends, even those unwilling and unwitting. He sways FĂ«anor, who has never held converse with him, this way. FĂ«anor and TĂșrin even share a few traits: pride, a touch of / tolerance for cruelty, and a chip on their shoulders from a sense that life has dealt with them unfairly. 1. Morgoth may well have aimed to encourage circumstances that would discourage tempering of TĂșrin's nature and encourage him to lean on traits that suit Morgoth best. The Easterling occupation of Dorthonion (a deliberate action on Morgoth's behalf - they stay there for fear of him even though he promised them Thargelion) disrupts TĂșrin's family/support network in his formative years. It is perhaps doubtful that Morgoth could deploy this with enough finesse to know how it would impact TĂșrin specifically, but his family would sure have been a target (they are the ruling family that are being displaced). It is more likely he understood psychologically that this action would cause the Easterlings to become bitter and lean on traits like cruelty, which they would turn on the Hadorians. Morwen's choice in direct response to this occupation (informed by her own pride too of course) to send him to Doriath alone and remain behind is implicated by the text in his fate: "Moreover, though she was willing that her son should be fostered in the halls of another, after the manner of that time, she would not yet humble her pride to be an alms-guest, not even of a king. Therefore the voice of HĂșrin, or the memory of his voice, was denied, and the first strand of the fate of TĂșrin was woven."

What were HĂșrin's words that she denied? He advised her not to wait for him, to flee and to go to Brethil, as a shadow fell on him when Doriath was named. The separation of TĂșrin from his family and what followed is implicated in part in sealing his fate. Could things have been different if they were not separated and they had gone to Brethil? Maybe. Maybe not. But the text does seem to imply it. There is a parallel perhaps to Nerdanel restraining the worse of FĂ«anor's nature whilst she remained with him. I don't mean to excuse either TĂșrin or FĂ«anor. I still think they remain responsible for their own choices. But acknowledge that if separated from (for want of better words) influences that may encourage reason, their decision making could be impacted.

2. It may matter less whether TĂșrin's actions and circumstances can be ascribed to a "curse" than that HĂșrin believes that they are. HĂșrin's witness to the tragedy of his children, and more importantly, the narrative that Morgoth spins around it is instrumental in manipulating HĂșrin and causing him to initiate the sequelae that leads to the ruin of Doriath. I reckon HĂșrin would be more messed up believing that all that befell his children was the result of Morgoth's pursuit of them, than if he could ascribe some to either coincidence or his son's own decisions.

"And at the last Melian spoke, and said: ‘HĂșrin Thalion, Morgoth hath bewitched thee; for he that seeth through Morgoth’s eyes, willing or unwilling, seeth all things crooked." (Ch. 22, Of the Ruin of Doriath) TLDR: The "curse" may have been a skilled manipulation and leveraging of psychology and behaviour on Morgoth's part rather than magical in nature. Whether or not the "curse" was actually governing TĂșrin's behaviour is probably less important than HĂșrin & TĂșrin believing it to be so, in bringing about Morgoth's purposes.

Sponsored

You are using an unsupported browser and things might not work as intended. Please make sure you're using the latest version of Chrome, Firefox, Safari, or Edge.